Upon CC as a Playoff Ace
By Charlie Geier
During a discussion regarding a potential first-round matchup with the Tigers, someone mentioned that CC Sabathia had bad playoff numbers. ESPN’s Peter Gammons tackled this subject today, in an interesting article which should calm some nerves in Yankee-land. The article can be found below:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/notebook?page=bbtn
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September 30, 2009 at 1:16 pm |
I wouldn’t worry about CC. He’s a great pitcher and should be fine. But what a POS article from Gammons. After arguing that CC is great because he is second in the league in innings pitched and has pitched at least 7 innings x times in a row, Gammons bases his opinion that CC will be fine on Girardi’s judicious use of him. So, by allowing CC to be second in innings pitched, Girardi and Eiland have successfully preserved him for the payoffs? A little contradictory, no? And what about Gammons’ excuse/argument that he “hit the wall” last year? Why no signs of that prior to the playoffs? He dominated in his last regular season start, but then just slammed into the proverbial wall for his playoff start, without any prior warning or signs of losing command or tiring? What drivel. Gammons has a conclusion and then just makes up shit to support it.
I agree with Gammons that CC should be fine, but not for the fabricated bullshit he cites. Isn’t it enough to say that CC is a great pitcher who shouldn’t be judged on a couple of starts just because those starts happened to occur in October, particularly where he has proven that he can handle the pressure of: (1) pitching for a contract, (2) pitching a team to the playoffs, and (3) pitching in NY as the highest-paid pitcher in baseball? If he was a choker, the Brewers would not have made the playoffs last year, and he would not be 19-7 in his first year in NY. But, he does have something to prove until he does actually pitch well in the post-season.
September 30, 2009 at 2:13 pm |
Come on. He is arguing that he’s had a great season, and is still fresh for the playoffs.
“Last year, Sabathia’s playoff start against the Phillies was his fourth straight on three days’ rest, and, as in the year before, he had expended all his energy getting his team into the playoffs.”
He is saying that while the innings this year down the stretch comprise quality starts, CC is not getting those starts on 3 days rest, they are coming on 5 and 6 days rest.
Some guys are notorious slow-starters, some hit a wall at the end. If you want to argue that CC hasn’t pitched his ass off to get teams in the playoffs the past two years, I won’t waste my time. We both know he has.
But I guess something good about a pitcher by a hall-of-famer and one of the most respected minds in baseball is invalid when it involves a Yankee. Now tell me that stat again by the egghead in his mother’s basement who proved that Derek Jeter can’t field ground balls on odd-numbered Tuesdays when the temperature is between 65-68 degrees.
September 30, 2009 at 3:04 pm |
How could you possibly interpret what I wrote as negative towards the Yankee, CC? I said “he is a great pitcher and should be fine.” I thus agreed with Gammons’ conclusion, just not how he got there. I don’t think it is necessary to make flimsy excuses or rationalizations for CC’s past playoff performances. That’s all. Hit the wall my ass. He threw a gem on the last day of the season, then sucked balls in the playoffs. Doesn’t a pitcher usually show signs of tiring before just suddenly sucking balls one day? He had a great season last year and showed no signs of tiring right through the the last day of the regular season when he did in fact pitch the Brewers into the playoffs. All I am saying is you don’t need to make excuses for the past to explain why this year will be different. Every year is different and there is no reason to believe that CC can’t handle pressure, simply because he has had a couple of shitty October starts. And I’m sure you defended Gammons as vehemently when he made excuses for Manny and Papi’s ped usage. This is the same kind of brilliant thinking from Gammons that has people believing that you want Jeter up in a big spot not because he is a career .317 hitter, but because he is “clutch.”
And CC is going to end up around 233-235 innings this year. Is that such a huge difference from 241 and 253 of the past two years? So, if CC had thrown a whopping 10 more innings this year, then Gammons would have opined the opposite, i.e., that CC’s about to hit the wall again? And if you accept Gammons’ bullshit as gospel, what happens after CC throws 16 innings in round one and 16 innings in round two and carries the Yanks on his shoulders to the WS? Does Gammons then expect CC to suddenly, and without warning “hit the wall” and suck in the WS because he will have even more innings than in the past two years when he had bad playoff games because he allegedly hit the wall?
My point, clearly, was that Gammon’s excuses for the failures were unnecessary. CC doesn’t need excuses. Sometimes guys just have shitty days.
September 30, 2009 at 3:25 pm |
“But by the time he faced Boston, he was at the 246-inning mark and was exhausted from pitching Cleveland into the postseason, and when he hit the wall, he completely lost his command.”
So, when CC hits the 246-inning mark this year, which will likely be during the ALCS, will he just suddenly “hit the wall” and “completely los[e] his command” again?
And Gammons cited R. Johnson as an example of a big-name pitcher who pitched a team to the WS in 2001 despite a prior history of not performing well in the playoffs. But did Gammons mention that Johnson pitched 249/2/3 regular season innings in 2001 at the age of 36? No. Why didn’t Johnson “hit the wall” in the playoffs in 2001? The great journalist doesn’t explain. Yeah, no flaws in Gammons’ article at all. How could there be, after all he’s writing about a Yankee. Where are Gammons’ examples of pitchers who performed better in the payoffs after decreasing their regular season workload? The Randy Johnson example supports my opinion that you can’t call a great pitcher a choker on account of a couple of bad post-season starts more than it supports Gammons’ opinion that CC’s past failures were due to a heavy regular season workload. After all, Johnson pitched fewer innings in 98 than in 01.
October 1, 2009 at 7:05 am |
Nice work by K-rod last night…
Doesn’t look like Joba can be trusted yet in a playoff start, which is some cause for concern. I think maybe the bullpen might be the best move, but that seems a waste after all this back and forth.
Maybe start Gaudin, but have an all-hands mentality, with Aceves, Robertson, and (gulp) Bruney ready to go in at the first sign of trouble?
Not the most comforting of signs, but if Joba can get back in the pen, the 7-8-9 combo of him Hughes and Mo would match up with the best back-ends I have seen in the playoffs.
October 1, 2009 at 9:55 am |
I listened to the bottom of the ninth in my car coming home from the train. What a pleasure. But I’m more upset about Reyes’ latest injury. There’s a pretty decent chance the kid will never be the same. The entire front office needs to go. They should just bring back Bobby V as GM/manager and let him start from scratch, with Omar as a scout/vp/player personnel guy.
Gaudin as a fourth starter against the Sox or Angels would be scary. He couldn’t get anyone out this year in petco park, now you need him to do it in fenway in October? Joba is a real dilemma. Its easy to blame the front office for over-managing him like all the papers are, but truth be told his stuff was not nearly as nasty this year as it was last year pre-shoulder problems and it was smart to try to limit his innings. As for the pen, perhaps they should have transitioned him back the last week or two of the season to see how he performs. Do you want his first relief appearance of the season to come during a playoff game, where he has had first inning struggles all season? Sounds too risky to me. I’d leave him off the roster for round one, let him start an extended spring game or two in Florida, and make him the 4th starter in round two, with the all hands on deck mentality.
October 1, 2009 at 2:01 pm |
Yeah, not exactly what I wanted to see.
As for Gaudin, I agree he is not the ideal candidate. However, in an emergncy he can give you 4-6 innings, and the Yankees are 8-2 in his starts for them. Is it too late to sign Moose?
October 1, 2009 at 2:14 pm |
Where are u getting that 8-2? He hasn’t started 10 games for the Yanks — that would be a 1/3 of the season. I thought he had 4 or 5 starts, tops.
And he had an ERA well over 5 in the NL, how could he possibly get anyone out in the mighty AL?
But if Gaudin is the #4, then Joba should have been sent to the pen this past week to get him ready for the playoffs.
Too late for Moose, but goodness gracious, Roger Clemens could still come back.
October 1, 2009 at 2:53 pm |
8-2 in appearances I should say, and 6-0 in starts. 11 runs allowed in 27 innings.
when he is healthy, which he wasn’t at times he can give you starts like the 7 inning, 4 hit, 2 run, 11K start he had at Seattle, or the 8 inning, 1 hit, 0 rins 9k he had against Texas.
I’m not saying its perfect, or desireable, but he has given the Yankees 5 innings a start, and not allowed more than 3 runs. If he can pitch to the 6th, the Yankees have enough in the pen to win an emergency start. In his most recent start tuesday against the Royals he went 6 2/3 strong.
We’ll see. Maybe Joba is the 4th starter, but maybe Gaudin has enough to match Penny/Dice-K or Ervin Santana.
We have to beat Det/ Minny first. who you got in that one?
October 1, 2009 at 3:03 pm |
Lets see how the match-ups work out. Looks like Detroit is up by 2 with 3 to go, and Verlander set for Sunday. It would be a real break for you guys if Verlander has to pitch on Sunday.
As for Gaudin, he won’t be facing the Royals or the Mariners in the playoffs. He’s a decent spot starter/long reliever and I liked that trade when it was made, but he should not be starting a playoff game under any circumstances.
October 3, 2009 at 5:57 pm |
Looks like Verlander will be pitching on Sunday. You guys have a pass to round two.
October 5, 2009 at 7:09 am |
So who you got? I think the Twins might ride the wave. I wish the Yankees had the same amount of time to scout and plan for their opponent as the other teams have had, but I guess they do have the advantage of playing a tired team with their top guys having to go Sunday and tomorrow.
October 5, 2009 at 10:10 am |
What are you talking about? Of course the Yanks have been scouting all of these teams for weeks. That’s a non-issue. With their extra resources and the division wrapped up weeks ago, I’d bet they have done more advanced scouting than any of the other teams.
I gotta go with Baker in the dome over the rookie on the road. Then you bastards will sweep the Twins.